IGCSE/GCSE/O & A Level/IB/University Student Forum
Student Forum => Latest News => Topic started by: Nobody on March 06, 2011, 04:42:42 pm
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PARIS (Reuters) - France will start enforcing a ban next month on full Islamic face veils, officials said on Thursday, meaning any veiled woman can be summoned to a police station and asked to remove her face-covering or pay a fine.
Officials say the law is mainly symbolic and police will not call in every veiled woman they see to avoid stigmatising Muslims.
But a Paris imam said forcing veiled women to present themselves at a police station would be just as uncomfortable.
When France passed the ban on full face veils last year, Muslim leaders voiced concern it could lead to veiled women being unfairly treated by police or singled out for harassment.
"My gut reaction is to say this is all a bit clumsy," said Moussa Niambele, the imam of a mosque in the north of Paris.
The ban forbids wearing any garment concealing the face in a public space, namely the street, public transport, shops, schools, courtrooms, hospitals and government buildings.
From April 11, police are instructed to summon veil-wearers to a station, where they will be asked to remove the garment for "identification" and leave it off. If the wearer refuses to remove it they will be fined up to 150 euros ($208).
"You are stopped in public by the police and forced to follow them to the station like an undesirable person," Niambele told Reuters. "This is altogether too much ceremony."
France's Muslim community of 5 million is Europe's largest. Fewer than 3,000 women wear the face veil, the goverment says.
As part of its public relations effort, the government has rolled out a website with the URL "uncovered-face.gouv.fr" and printed posters and pamphlets to be passed out in city halls.
"Nobody is allowed, in a public space, to wear a garment designed to conceal their face," says the poster under a picture of "Marianne", a symbolic female figure of the French Republic.
The ban comes into force as President Nicolas Sarkozy is putting a special focus on Islam and its role in a secular society ahead of a presidential election in 2012.
Some critics have dismissed the ban as a purely political instrument, given the rarity of veil wearers in France.
Concerns the ban could lead to humiliation for Muslims were underscored last year when a French woman attacked a veiled Emirati tourist at a luxury boutique invoking the planned ban.
Source - Yahoo news
link below
http://in.news.yahoo.com/france-enforce-muslim-veil-ban-april-20110303-113154-949.html
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funny.
So when ordinary people start wearing face masks to protect themselves from germs, will they be foced to take it off? Or pay a fine to keep it off?
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They give in such lame reasons. They'll pay.
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Idiotic step. What is their benefit by the ban anyways ?
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Their country, their rules. Respect them or leave. That's the way I see it.
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They give in such lame reasons. They'll pay.
Who is 'they' ? And 'pay' what ? Mind elaborating ?
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Their country, their rules. Respect them or leave. That's the way I see it.
Libyan ruler Gaddafi is in power for 40 years or so. Now he is arranging air strikes on protesters. "Respect Gaddafi or leave"!!! Is that the way you see Gaddafi's actions?
Lets face it clear cut: You see it that way because it involves Muslims. Had there been a ban on any Jewish religious symbol (and a media publicity the way the veil ban is portrayed), you would most definitely call it "Undemocratic", "discrimination", "anti-semitism" and so on.
If any country/group of people rejects the Holocaust (FYI, I do believe in it), that would be "hurtful" and "discriminative", isn't it?
We want a peaceful world with no hates/discrimination based on religion, ethnicity or race.
Anyway, I don't think I should debate on religious grounds in the forum. Remove the thread if you like. I just expressed my stand.
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Libyan ruler Gaddafi is in power for 40 years or so. Now he is arranging air strikes on protesters. "Respect Gaddafi or leave"!!! Is that the way you see Gaddafi's actions?
That, my friend, is a very poor analogy on your part.
Lets face it clear cut: You see it that way because it involves Muslims. Had there been a ban on any Jewish religious symbol (and a media publicity the way the veil ban is portrayed), you would most definitely call it "Undemocratic", "discrimination", "anti-semitism" and so on.
We want a peaceful world with no hates/discrimination based on religion, ethnicity or race.
Cool story, bro.
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Cool story, bro.
I edited my post. ;)
That, my friend, is a very poor analogy on your part.
I love it(! :P) when people say such things without stating any reason!
Anyways, care to elaborate? PM me if you want.
Again, no hard feelings. ;)
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I edited my post. ;)
I love it(! :P) when people say such things without stating any reason!
Anyways, care to elaborate? PM me if you want.
Again, no hard feelings. ;)
I've got better things to do.
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I've got better things to do.
Then, you wouldn't have the sufficient analogical drive to start posting on this topic in the first place, my sweet little brother. ;)
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Then, you wouldn't have the sufficient analogical drive to start posting on this topic in the first place, my sweet little brother. ;)
To rebuke you :
It's impossible to argue with a person that obviously lacks a firm understanding of the meaning of the word 'analogy' and its related derivatives.
In short; stick to using words you understand.
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To rebuke you :
It's impossible to argue with a person that obviously lacks a firm understanding of the meaning of the word 'analogy' and its related derivatives.
In short; stick to using words you understand.
Wohoo, brother. Cool down. I wouldn't have replied to your post if I knew that you would so easily get heated/angry.
Anyways, I would prefer to not argue further. Somebody here could get out of control. ::)
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Wohoo, brother. Cool down. I wouldn't have replied to your post if I knew that you would so easily get heated/angry.
Anyways, I would prefer to not argue further. Somebody here could get out of control. ::)
Aye.
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Ahhh. I love you bothh :D
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^ LOL ! Randomnesssssss. :P
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There is no such thing as "democracy" - Azrael I can see you have no idea what is really going on in the world nowadays. Rather than stick to FOX news have you ever visited any of these places you claim knowledge of?
Until you do, your presumptions hold no ground, and you need to stop acting like a know-it-all.
I come from a place affected by severe human injustice, and rather than live it the way it is, I seek to change it and make that my life's goal. I honestly do not care what you think of me, because I am motivated by my own experiences, and you need to understand this - your pseudo intellectual fantasies do not affect anyone else in the least, and you need to destroy this ego of yours, before someone comes and trolls you so bad you start crying for your mother.
tl;dr: umadbro?
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Rfi!
Don't get hyper excited, yeah. ;)
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There is no such thing as "democracy" - Azrael I can see you have no idea what is really going on in the world nowadays. Rather than stick to FOX news have you ever visited any of these places you claim knowledge of?
Until you do, your presumptions hold no ground, and you need to stop acting like a know-it-all.
I come from a place affected by severe human injustice, and rather than live it the way it is, I seek to change it and make that my life's goal. I honestly do not care what you think of me, because I am motivated by my own experiences, and you need to understand this - your pseudo intellectual fantasies do not affect anyone else in the least, and you need to destroy this ego of yours, before someone comes and trolls you so bad you start crying for your mother.
tl;dr: umadbro?
i can say rfi controll your emotions
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An outburst that has been held back for some time now would probably sound emotional, but I assure you, I am not emotional in the least. :)
Like I said, I am an old member of this forum, so do not just dismiss this as some kind of premature judgmental rant.
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Old member?
Look, if you have a problem, we can talk it out.
yeah? ;)
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Don't worry about it lol. None of anyone's business unless I pm them. ;)
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Them? ::)
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What an awful idea now five european countries are banning the equivalent of a nuns outfit while not banning nuns outfits. Of course it is discriminatory.
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Of course it is discriminatory.
The whole point.
Action based on prejudice.
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The solution is for everyone to wear one and refuse to pay any fine.
Laws should be enforceable. If they are not because decent people disobey them to make a point, then it will not be enforced.
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(http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ls8nm1aMbS1r1xmyxo1_500.png)
^_^
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To provoke the police I used to walk around London in a nazi SS hat.
I was stopped by the police a couple of times and told them, 'what can you do? arrest me?'
They never did.
Whatever you wear does not trespass on anyone else's space.
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To provoke the police I used to walk around London in a nazi SS hat.
I was stopped by the police a couple of times and told them, 'what can you do? arrest me?'
They never did.
Whatever you wear does not trespass on anyone else's space.
LOOOOOOOL ;D
That must have been very .... thrilling. ;D :P
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Yes. The police must know.
The law is the law and a statement is a statement.
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Yes. The police must know.
The law is the law and a statement is a statement.
Which is why you didn't get arrested ... :P
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maybe. the police should enoforce the LAW and nothing else like mindless robots.
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maybe. the police should enoforce the LAW and nothing else like mindless robots.
Perhaps that's how they were trained ... ::) Mindless robots.
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France can do what ever they want. They can burn the Quran or mosque for all i care. It's a sovereign nation and has every right to do so.
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France can do what ever they want. They can burn the Quran or mosque for all i care. It's a sovereign nation and has every right to do so.
Where is the freedom gone now ?
Those women who choose to wear the niqab have to pay for their liberty ? ::)
It's racist, discriminating, and unnecessary.
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France can do what ever they want. They can burn the Quran or mosque for all i care. It's a sovereign nation and has every right to do so.
Of course- you wouldn't care. You don't live there, you're not affected by their new laws, you're not a lady that's being discriminated against. So no, just don't care. because it's coool y'know.
And just so you know, the least a person could do, is care.
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The least a person could do, is care.
Seconded.
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Of course- you wouldn't care. You don't live there, you're not affected by their new laws, you're not a lady that's being discriminated against. So no, just don't care. because it's coool y'know.
And just so you know, the least a person could do, is care.
My friend, if Muslims are so unhappy with France they can all migrate to some other place. Fact is, they would continue to live in France because it guarantees them a stable future with a clean and secure environment which their country of origin didn't assure them of.
Saudi Arabia makes hijab obligatory ~ all Non-Muslims are required to wear it
France bans not just Hijab but literally all religious symbols in public sphere.
Do you see any similarity there?
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My friend, if Muslims are so unhappy with France they can all migrate to some other place. Fact is, they would continue to live in France because it guarantees them a stable future with a clean and secure environment which their country of origin didn't assure them of.
Saudi Arabia makes hijab obligatory ~ all Non-Muslims are required to wear it
France bans not just Hijab but literally all religious symbols in public sphere.
Do you see any similarity there?
Erh- no they can't. why can't they? because they're FRENCH. where are they going to go? That's their country.
And in Saudi, they don't dish out passports, so if someone doesn't want to cover, they can leave because saudi isn't their country.
So no- no similarity, I'm afraid.
But it's not about that- you spoke abut caring.
at LEAST you could care.
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Saying you can leave if you do not like it is like saying there should be worldwide segregation of races, with no two people living together who do not agree on everything.
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Saying you can leave if you do not like it is like saying there should be worldwide segregation of races, with no two people living together who do not agree on everything.
Exactly.
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Haha, man I find it so damn funny. I mean, I am wearing the veil, I want to cover, my choice. Am I going around shouting--hey, you there, you see me, you loser, you have to do this, okay? LOL...what the heck, my life, my choice. I mean the least I am doing is harming someone. Now just because there are people who are actually criminals and use this to their advantage, they are going to ban it? Don't you see criminals wearing 'smart' clothes, with a 'smart' attitude... course you do. But do you ban smartness (Imagine which 'code of article' would that be :P). Point is, banning the veil is no solution. You call yourself a liberal nation, with liberal ideas, let us follow our religion. I love to hear vows of the modern world...how 'modern' it is.
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Haha, man I find it so damn funny. I mean, I am wearing the veil, I want to cover, my choice. Am I going around shouting--hey, you there, you see me, you loser, you have to do this, okay? LOL...what the heck, my life, my choice. I mean the least I am doing is harming someone. Now just because there are people who are actually criminals and use this to their advantage, they are going to ban it? Don't you see criminals wearing 'smart' clothes, with a 'smart' attitude... course you do. But do you ban smartness (Imagine which 'code of article' would that be :P). Point is, banning the veil is no solution. You call yourself a liberal nation, with liberal ideas, let us follow our religion. I love to hear vows of the modern world...how 'modern' it is.
You're not harming anyone wearing the veil :P
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Saying you can leave if you do not like it is like saying there should be worldwide segregation of races, with no two people living together who do not agree on everything.
Agreed.
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Erh- no they can't. why can't they? because they're FRENCH. where are they going to go? That's their country.
And in Saudi, they don't dish out passports, so if someone doesn't want to cover, they can leave because saudi isn't their country.
So no- no similarity, I'm afraid.
But it's not about that- you spoke abut caring.
at LEAST you could care.
Almost all of the veil wearing women in France come from North Africa. Like i said they can move to England or Sweden where there is freedom. If you are French you will have to obey what the French constitution says. And it's not even a discrimination against Islam, this ban covers all the religions.
I would care and i would certainly even rebel should it happen in MY country
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Almost all of the veil wearing women in France come from North Africa. Like i said they can move to England or Sweden where there is freedom. If you are French you will have to obey what the French constitution says. And it's not even a discrimination against Islam, this ban covers all the religions.
I would care and i would certainly even rebel should it happen in MY country
you're right, cuz which other religion talks about covering your beauty by wearing the veil? ::)
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How many people remeber a french massacre of about 5,000 arabs in Paris only about 50 years ago? There is something evil in every frenchman which the sight of a veil wearing muslim can bring out.
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How many people remeber a french massacre of about 5,000 arabs in Paris only about 50 years ago? There is something evil in every frenchman which the sight of a veil wearing muslim can bring out.
so that's still discriminatory, right?
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yes, there were not an equal number or french people killed.
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They are not banning priests robes or nuns habits, crosses, cricifixes or anything christian.
Meanwhile in Iran a convert to christianity is to be executed for abandoning islam.
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They are not banning priests robes or nuns habits, crosses, cricifixes or anything christian.
Meanwhile in Iran a convert to christianity is to be executed for abandoning islam.
Iran is just a complete different story. ::)
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Not completely. In Egypt too, christian converts have been murdered for abandoning islam.
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I think that's part of the Shariah law.
I'M NOTTTTT 100% sure, so don't take my word for it.
But yes, when I walk pass a nun, we always exchange smiles and realise how similar we look, but I'm considered 'weird' and she's considered 'holy'.
Double standards.
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I smile at women in hijab too. Two of my students wear it.
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I smile at women in hijab too. Two of my students wear it.
:)
I hope they smile at you too. A narration by one of the prophet's companions said something along the lines of: I have never seen anyone smile more than the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him).
Which is why it is sunnah for Muslims to smile.
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When I teach muslim women though they do not wear a full face veil.
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When I teach muslim women though they do not wear a full face veil.
That's alright- there's different opinions on whether wearing it is obligatory or not.
I don't wear it here, but I wear it in places like Birmingham and other countries where I can.
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Underneath a veil muslim girls are every bit as girly as any other girl, and work harder than western girls too.
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Underneath a veil muslim girls are every bit as girly as any other girl, and work harder than western girls too.
You got that right, sir. 8) :P
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Underneath a veil muslim girls are every bit as girly as any other girl, and work harder than western girls too.
Yerrrps ;)
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And how will they enforce a ban on tourists wearing the veil, or is that not against the law?
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And how will they enforce a ban on tourists wearing the veil, or is that not against the law?
Ahhh, didn't think of that.
But I'm sure it's against the law for tourists to aswell, maybe they wont let them pass the airport of they refuse to take their veil off.
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Underneath a veil muslim girls are every bit as girly as any other girl, and work harder than western girls too.
Not to be too generalistic, but I think almost any nationality in the world works harder than the westerners. :)
They are not banning priests robes or nuns habits, crosses, cricifixes or anything christian.
Meanwhile in Iran a convert to christianity is to be executed for abandoning islam.
Never heard of a full face-covering nun habit though.
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It's quite Sad to be honest. But These kind of things are Reminders that make me Thank god for the Things I have =] Allahoma laka Alhamd <3
I have a friend 'a Non Muslim' and She keeps telling me gosh "it's SO HOT I'm boiling HERE. How can you survive under what you're wearing ?! " { Gulf countries are ACTUALLY deserts ::) } .. The ONLY thing I end up saying is 'It's fine with me =] ' , because I'd rather Boil under this Sun than burn in the fire of Hell.
So I wish Allah fills these ladies' hearts with Patience and let them Endure it because it's Worth it , Wallah the Hijab is a Gift from Allah that is ESPECIALLY made for the Ladies :)
Alhmadulilah <3
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Young people in the west do not work hard. There is work in the fields picket fruit which pays £300 a week but most young people here think it is beneath them and don't do it. They would rather be unemployed and live on benefits.
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Insert Quote
Young people in the west do not work hard. There is work in the fields picket fruit which pays £300 a week but most young people here think it is beneath them and don't do it. They would rather be unemployed and live on benefits.
Precisely my point. But I'm not one to speak since I am not in the unfortunate position of either picking fruit or living on benefits.
I'd rather Boil under this Sun than burn in the fire of Hell.
Does your chances for getting to heaven differ with the type of veil you wear? Do women who don't cover their whole faces go to hell most definitely?
Disclaimer: This is not a debate, just a question.
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the Hijab is a Gift from Allah that is ESPECIALLY made for the Ladies :)
Seconded. 8)
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Precisely my point. But I'm not one to speak since I am not in the unfortunate position of either picking fruit or living on benefits.
Does your chances for getting to heaven differ with the type of veil you wear? Do women who don't cover their whole faces go to hell most definitely?
Disclaimer: This is not a debate, just a question.
Hijab/veil is meant to hide a woman's beauty and charm. The 'way' she covers herself is definitely taken into consideration. A lady completely cloaked walks hand in hand with a namehram man (stranger; no blood relative); her point of hijab is lost. If a girl wears a head scarf to enhance her beauty (suppose by letting the bangs out or making a 'camel-hump' out of her hair) than that's not hijab. They are sinning, not pleasing their lord.
This is what the Quran says:-
Surah An-Nur, Verses 30 and 31
'And Say to the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent (like both eyes for necessity to see the way, or outer palms of hands or one eye or dress like veil, gloves, head-cover, apron), and to draw their veils all over Juyubihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bossoms) and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband's fathers, or their sons, or their husband's sons, or their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sister's sons, or their (Muslim women) (i.e. sisters in Islam), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of feminine sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allah to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful'
But the law takes into account the real-life situations. There are several cases where a woman is compelled to reveal her face like while taking passport photographs, during marriage, giving evidence in court, or when a country like France take drastic actions. If veiling of the faces cause inconvenience, the women are excused.
To answer the latter part; we can never say who is going to hell 'most definitely', it's only unto Allah to judge people and give them their right position after death.
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Hijab/veil is meant to hide a woman's beauty and charm. The 'way' she covers herself is definitely taken into consideration. A lady completely cloaked walks hand in hand with a namehram man (stranger; no blood relative); her point of hijab is lost. If a girl wears a head scarf to enhance her beauty (suppose by letting the bangs out or making a 'camel-hump' out of her hair) than that's not hijab. They are sinning, not pleasing their lord.
This is what the Quran says:-
Surah An-Nur, Verses 30 and 31
'And Say to the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent (like both eyes for necessity to see the way, or outer palms of hands or one eye or dress like veil, gloves, head-cover, apron), and to draw their veils all over Juyubihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bossoms) and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband's fathers, or their sons, or their husband's sons, or their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sister's sons, or their (Muslim women) (i.e. sisters in Islam), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of feminine sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allah to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful'
But the law takes into account the real-life situations. There are several cases where a woman is compelled to reveal her face like while taking passport photographs, during marriage, giving evidence in court, or when a country like France take drastic actions. If veiling of the faces cause inconvenience, the women are excused.
To answer the latter part; we can never say who is going to hell 'most definitely', it's only unto Allah to judge people and give them their right position after death.
Spot on! ;)
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Thanks for the info. Didn't realise the Quran was so clear on it.
That in brackets, is it interpretation?
Why do some Muslim groups not cover the whole face? Many of the Muslims in my country don't cover their entire faces.
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I am not an expert on the quran but I do know you can find justification in the bible for just about anything you want to do no matter how insane. Iis the quarn consistent throughout or does it say in different pages anything which might be thought a contradiction?
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Thanks for the info. Didn't realise the Quran was so clear on it.
That in brackets, is it interpretation?
Why do some Muslim groups not cover the whole face? Many of the Muslims in my country don't cover their entire faces.
Explanation, not interpretation.
Things have changed over time. People look for ease and comfort while still remaining inside the border line of modesty.
I dont do Niqaab (full-face cover), myself.
I am not an expert on the quran but I do know you can find justification in the bible for just about anything you want to do no matter how insane. Iis the quarn consistent throughout or does it say in different pages anything which might be thought a contradiction?
Quran is a miracle. It is the answer to every freaking question.
Jews and Christians are considered as 'people of the book'. They believe in the same God as we Muslims do, but the scriptures revealed to them were different.
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I am not an expert on the quran but I do know you can find justification in the bible for just about anything you want to do no matter how insane. Iis the quarn consistent throughout or does it say in different pages anything which might be thought a contradiction?
No contradiction. Read it, just a part of it. You may learn something new :)
Thanks for the info. Didn't realise the Quran was so clear on it.
That in brackets, is it interpretation?
Why do some Muslim groups not cover the whole face? Many of the Muslims in my country don't cover their entire faces.
No, the bracket is just to make it even more clear.
Because lots of people do lots of things. Which is why we say, don't judge Islaam by the Muslims. Read the Quraan & The hadiths, everything is clear.
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I read part of it. The start of it is just like reading nietsche. I will read some of it tonight so I can argue with you tomorrow.
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I read part of it. The start of it is just like reading nietsche. I will read some of it tonight so I can argue with you tomorrow.
hahahahaha. ok :)
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I am not an expert on the quran but I do know you can find justification in the bible for just about anything you want to do no matter how insane. Iis the quarn consistent throughout or does it say in different pages anything which might be thought a contradiction?
There is justification for every thing in Quran as well. If you are not comfortable with Bible then don't ever pick Quran as they are so same in content.
You will see a lot of contradiction in Quran if you read it without any guide or knowledge. For example in one verse it is permissible to drink alcohol as long as it does not disrupt your prayers but in Medina God reveals to Muhammed that alcohol is forbidden in every way.
I forgot the name though for these verses which should not be obeyed to.
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Jews and Christians are considered as 'people of the book'. They believe in the same God as we Muslims do, but the scriptures revealed to them were different.
Disagree. How can one God have conflicting laws and views and personality?
For example in one verse it is permissible to drink alcohol as long as it does not disrupt your prayers but in Medina God reveals to Muhammed that alcohol is forbidden in every way.
Apparently its called the doctrine of abrogation.
Read the Quraan & The hadiths, everything is clear.
Have read parts of it. Not any more enlightened though. :)
I am not an expert on the quran but I do know you can find justification in the bible for just about anything you want to do no matter how insane.
Um, like what? I bet you can do the same for the Constitution if you interpret it 'properly'.
Disclaimer: This is not at all an attempt to start a religious debate. Just commenting on other people's comments. So don't ban me. :)
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There is justification for every thing in Quran as well. If you are not comfortable with Bible then don't ever pick Quran as they are so same in content.
You will see a lot of contradiction in Quran if you read it without any guide or knowledge. For example in one verse it is permissible to drink alcohol as long as it does not disrupt your prayers but in Medina God reveals to Muhammed that alcohol is forbidden in every way.
I forgot the name though for these verses which should not be obeyed to.
May Allah guide you all.
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@monicooper: do you seriously believe the bible hasn't been changed?
You should listen to talks by Zakir Naik- he'll clear any confusion you have inshaAllah.
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There is justification for every thing in Quran as well. If you are not comfortable with Bible then don't ever pick Quran as they are so same in content.
You will see a lot of contradiction in Quran if you read it without any guide or knowledge. For example in one verse it is permissible to drink alcohol as long as it does not disrupt your prayers but in Medina God reveals to Muhammed that alcohol is forbidden in every way.
I forgot the name though for these verses which should not be obeyed to.
I assume that you are a Muslim. It shouldn't be hard for you to provide evidence from the Holy Book, right?
Where is the verse in the quran where it was said that it's "permissible" to drink alcohol?
It is stated in the Qur’ân: “They ask you regarding wine and gambling. Say, in both of them is major sin, and there is some benefit for men, but the sin of them is far greater than benefit. ”
(Surah Baqarah)
Do you see the words "major sin"? Fine still, no direct order was given to stop consuming alcohol.
Second step: “O Believers’ do not approach Salâh while intoxicated.” (Surah Nisaa)
Reason:- There was an incident during which the companions of the prophet prayed while they were drunk. Including the Imam, and he had many errors while reciting Surahs during the prayer.
Finally, to stop confusion Prophet (saw) prayed to God: “O Allah! Grant us a clear cut for regarding alcohol.”
In response to this the 3rd and 4th verses concerning the complete prohibition of alcohol, were revealed as part of Surah Ma’idah:
"O you who believe! Intoxicants, gambling, idolatry and arrows (for seeking help on decision) one an abomination of order that you may be successful.
Shaytan seeks only to cast amongst you enmity and hatred by means of strong drink and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allah and from his worship, will you then not refrain? ”
(Surah Ma’idah 90)
Allah in his wisdom; firstly disclosed the evils in alcohol, then prohibited it at Salâh times and finally declared it absolutely Haraam. Do the verses contradict each other? It was never said it's okay to consume Alcohol. Only human mentality.
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Disagree. How can one God have conflicting laws and views and personality?
What do the Tourah, Ingeel and Quran tell us?
What messages did Prophet Moses(saw), Prophet Jesus(saw) and Prophet Muhammed (saw) (messenger for entire mankind and seal of the prophets) carried to their people?
SUBMISSION TO THE WILL OF ONE GOD!
God has no conflicts in laws and personality. It's the humans themselves, who change and adopt their own methods. Quran; is the only reveled book that hasn't been changed or re-written over time.
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To the original post:
Seems like the French have some seriously distorted vision of the world. Like stated before, this is a discriminatory act and should not be passed. Wearing a veil in public harms no one, if it's about revealing one's features to the other people you're with being a right of everyone in a crowd, then make-up and sunglasses (as well as maybe other accessories that alter/hide the face) in public must also be banned. Like a poster pointed out, if it's about a criminal insignia then anyone dressing like Jason Bourne or James Bond should also be deported.
Someone also said that since France is a sovereign state, it has every right to pass any law. Of course it does; since my father is the earning person of my family, and I don't earn, he has every right to tell me to get the hell out of his place. But here, terms like 'human rights' emerge which prevents people in power from being unfair to those who do not have power. There may be immigrants to France a generation back, but now that generation has produced a new line of people, French people, who may not even know their mother tongue and are just French. They're not North African anymore in terms of culture and nationality--just imagine Black people living in the United States for ages being sent to Africa because in some alternate universe, all terrorists are Black. Yes, ridiculous. Muslims should immigrate in times of testing to places where they can better follow their beliefs, and French women who feel strongly about hijab should immigrate, imo. However, it in no way justifies the French government's attempts to undermine our culture and religion. Those women are now French women, not outsiders. Don't grant visas if you can't have foreign blood in your citizens.
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My personal space should not be violated by any law, made by soverign state even if it is France.
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Of course in literal definition of contradiction it is. Before it was a major sin but not totally banned but later on it was completely forbidden.
And i am not criticizing Quran By the way, I adore it's evolutionary way of presenting verses.
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What do the Tourah, Ingeel and Quran tell us?
What messages did Prophet Moses(saw), Prophet Jesus(saw) and Prophet Muhammed (saw) (messenger for entire mankind and seal of the prophets) carried to their people?
SUBMISSION TO THE WILL OF ONE GOD!
God has no conflicts in laws and personality. It's the humans themselves, who change and adopt their own methods. Quran; is the only reveled book that hasn't been changed or re-written over time.
Hey, sorry. Can't reply to that becuase I may be banned again if I menion my opinion. Care for a PM?
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Hey, sorry. Can't reply to that becuase I may be banned again if I menion my opinion. Care for a PM?
Send the PM to me too please?